MNSBR: Yes IíM The New Guy, Yes I Wanna Race At Bir - MNSBR

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Yes IíM The New Guy, Yes I Wanna Race At Bir

#1 User is offline   That One Kid Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 08:29 AM

Iím 16, turning 17 this year, got myself an F4i last summer when I was 15... Looking to take either it or buying another bike this summer and go race in the lightweight class. If any of you pro racers out there would tell me... would this bike make a good track bike? Could I be competitive enough on it to actually make it somewhere? What kinds of times are we looking at for the 600 class around the long course at The Track? Should I start out RACING on something smaller/newer, for example an RC390?? Would I need to be in the Ultralite class for that specific machine? Very interested in the sport and as every teenager looking to racing out there in the world I think I could have what it takes... Would love to hear back.
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 09:25 AM

I'm no racer, but starting off small seems to help... (and I'm bored and like to pretend I know what I'm talking about). I'm talking small like pit bikes. Ripping around and dragging knee at Pro Kart was somehow a useful experience in gaining confidence and better form for cornering. Stepping up from that, I thought DCTC was a nice track to take fast corners on a big bike. They key here is getting to ride the exact same corners, with the exact same conditions, over and over until you find what you're capable of. The bike is rarely the limiting factor. After that, I'd think you could go scream around BIR with more confidence to hold fast lines above 100 mph while laying down around corners. I never rode BIR on a bike, but shit was still plenty intense in a car.

Your best choice would be to jump in a ZARS track day, and/or Road Closed track day. You'll learn you otherwise would never get to know or learn on your own:
http://www.ridezars.com/
http://www.roadclose...ing.com/drupal/

Fun times at Pro Kart:
Maple Grove: https://www.youtube....h?v=E3OyTQzlwnE
Burnsville: https://www.youtube....h?v=HIHFiYmXX1o
Go kart tracks: https://www.youtube....h?v=HIHFiYmXX1o (Apparently I thought the music was more important than the bike sounds :( )

DCTC: https://www.youtube....h?v=46LpiCiJbO0
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 09:33 AM

Hey, let me direct your attention to the info posted on the CRA club website specifically about being a new racer: https://www.cra-mn.c...ome-a-cra-racer

Be aware that the minimum age is 18 but it is possible to petition and has been before.

Your F4i is not legal for the LW class. It would be Middleweight. Small bikes are good too, but imo, it makes the most sense to get on track with what you have and decide from there if you think it necessary to swith platforms.

Whatever you do, your first step should be to sign up for the New Racer Seminar next month: http://www.mnsportbi...showtopic=80240
Then, review the rules found on the CRA website to get an idea of the structure and how the classes are organized.
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 09:43 AM

Do the new guys have access to the Track section: http://www.mnsportbi...php?showforum=8
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#5 User is offline   That One Kid Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 10:54 AM

Alright, so maybe I need to know where I sit as a rider before I try to go anywhere, I might do a few track days and see what kind of times I sit at. What are some times for the long course that are competitive at BIR?
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#6 User is offline   Kent Larson Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 11:03 AM

View PostThat One Kid, on 13 February 2018 - 08:29 AM, said:

Should I start out RACING on something smaller/newer, for example an RC390??


My advice is always to start racing in a low power class, lightweight or even ultralight. I even published a book that talks about how racers who start out with bikes having gobs of power have a much harder time learning to corner fast. Far too many point-and-shoot, park it mid-corner then light it up on exit riders are born from 100+ horsepower bikes.

I'm saving up for a RS390 myself. It's doubtful that I'll ever be back on the racetrack but I'm sure I'll have fun breaking it in before it goes to my son in a few years.

You can find "Motorcycle Track Day Handbook" by Kent Larson on Amazon for cheap if interested. It has some general advice about getting into racing and a great chapter on suspension setup.

Later,
Kent Larson in Woodbury
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 11:13 AM

View PostThat One Kid, on 13 February 2018 - 10:54 AM, said:

Alright, so maybe I need to know where I sit as a rider before I try to go anywhere, I might do a few track days and see what kind of times I sit at. What are some times for the long course that are competitive at BIR?



If you have never ridden the track before, there's no need to worry about lap times. There's no problem racing even if you have no trackday experience. Getting thrown in the deep end is the fastest way to speed up the learning curve, especially with the CRA. There are fast racers in all the classes and they'll do a fantastic job of helping you out as well as humbling you with theire experience and craft.

Trackdays are also an option and another way to get your feet wet before committing to a race effort. My advice would still be to go to Motoprimo on March 18th and see what it's all about.
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 11:16 AM

If you're curious, clock Jason on his ZX6R short course laps:
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#9 User is offline   That One Kid Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 11:56 AM

I saw that video a couple of days ago, I remember my dad and my dads friend who rode AMA in the 90ís saying 1:38.00 was competitive on that track. That guy was flying, but looking at it like that and watching Pro guys NOW, it seems like this dude is riding pretty slow...
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#10 User is offline   aj_day Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:04 PM

I am not sure about the age thing. I raced during 2014 and 2015. During that time there were very few under 18 racers on the grid. The ones that were had grown up riding/racing dirt bikes in families with multi-generational racing experience and support. I also don't know your history and experience. Maybe you are in that boat?

With that said, if you can petition your way into racing, it will teach you a lot more a lot faster than track days, and the CRA is a great group. Middleweight novice however is not a very good place to start with limited track experience. Race prepping a street bike is also a moderate to extremely expensive commitment, depending on the class you want to race. If you are hell bent on jumping into racing, and you can get the age petition approved, I recommend starting in the N250 spec class, featherweight, or ultralight depending on how much money and time you have to spend on your bike. The N250 spec class is by far the most economical way to race a motorcycle. I also recommend buying an existing race bike.

If the racing thing does not work out, your best shot at getting on the track ASAP is an incremental approach that involves riding track days with your existing bike. I am not sure how Road Closed and ZARS handle under 18 riders. Figure that out first. Then take your 600 to a couple DCTC track days, and then take it a few BIR track days. Most of the ZARS coaches are (or have been) racers. ZARS also has a race specifically for non-licensed racers each time they do a BIR track day. The ZARS "shootout" is a great way to try racing for the first time, and you don't need a fully race prepped bike.
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:04 PM

View PostThat One Kid, on 13 February 2018 - 11:56 AM, said:

I saw that video a couple of days ago, I remember my dad and my dads friend who rode AMA in the 90ís saying 1:38.00 was competitive on that track. That guy was flying, but looking at it like that and watching Pro guys NOW, it seems like this dude is riding pretty slow...


Ok.
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#12 User is offline   That One Kid Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:22 PM

Have any of you seen these? http://www.450gp.com/EN/vehicles.html I donít mean to be rude. Would one of these bikes be better for me since Iím used to my 600ís power a little more?
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#13 User is offline   WillMill Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:28 PM

View Postaj_day, on 13 February 2018 - 12:04 PM, said:

I recommend starting in the N250 spec class, featherweight, or ultralight depending on how much money and time you have to spend on your bike. The N250 spec class is by far the most economical way to race a motorcycle.


The N250 spec class no longer exists in CRA. However, you can race a N250 in FW. You can even build a N250 to superbike specs, and still be FW SS legal. I definitely wouldn't recommend turning your F4i into a race bike, for a few different reasons. One being the cost, it would cost far more to convert it, than what you can buy a race prepped bike for. Two, the F4i is not a common race platform, so the availability of parts would be limited. If you were extremely fast, maybe the F4i would be competitive in novice, but you wouldn't stand a chance against experts. I also think going out racing with zero track experience, and only one year of riding under your belt would be quite intimidating in the MW(600) class. I recommend Featherweight or Lightweight. Those are the classes that are really competitive based on your ability, and not so much the machine. Right now, there are only a couple novice racers in ultralight, and its an odd class where there arent that many bikes available that are competitive, you would probably end up riding by yourself out there.

As was stated above, definitely sign up for the CRA new rider school at MotoPrimo, there is lots of valuble information there. Doing a track day isn't necessary, but being under 18, you are going to have a hard time getting the stewards to allow you to race without any experience. There is a reason why that rule exists. But definitely come up to BIR for the race weekends. Talk with racers, check out the bikes, and do some volunteering. Quite a few new racers come to the track thinking that they are going to be the next Valentino Rossi, but the truth is that if you havent been doing this since you learned to walk, you probably wont ever become more than a club racer.

That being said, I hope to see you up there, and look forward to you becoming a racer, good luck!
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#14 User is offline   WillMill Icon

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:29 PM

View PostThat One Kid, on 13 February 2018 - 12:22 PM, said:

Have any of you seen these? http://www.450gp.com/EN/vehicles.html I donít mean to be rude. Would one of these bikes be better for me since Iím used to my 600ís power a little more?


How deep are your pockets?

Either way, those are UL bikes, and like I mentioned above, there are very few novice racers in UL. And dominating the expert UL class are the Kraemers, which I dont think a 450 would compete with.

http://kraemer-motor...ucts/hkr-evo-2/
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 12:36 PM

View PostThat One Kid, on 13 February 2018 - 12:22 PM, said:

... since I'm used to my 600's power a little more?


No, you are not used to it. You may be able to ride street with it, but you haven't really ridden it. Do track days, start at the bottom and earn your way up as you find your riding skill. If you really want to, start with the CRA first and get right to racing. It's possible. But just understand that you don't know as much as you think you know. Many of us have been where you are. Trust what we have to say.

WIth that said. Try your F4i at a track day. You'll find out a lot about your bike and yourself. Then save yourself the money of converting an outdated platform into a race bike and buy a Featherweight, Ultralight or Lightweight race bike. Or build a bike for those classes if you have the money and want to do it that way.

Other higher weight classes are an option, but I would recommend having more track days experience before going that route. For safety.
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